Now available, a .25 ACP brass priming kit. This kit
contains all the tools needed to prime and re-prime your .25
ACP brass. Click here for
details...
Here are some emails I received from real folks that have used the Precision
Rifle .25 ACP Breech Plug Conversion:
Deer Ray, The 235 grain QT
did its job again. I got this buck with a Winchester .50 caliber using the 25
ACP primer conversion. The conversion has worked very well giving tighter groups
when compared to the 209 primers. It also leaves almost no fouling around the
firing pin and breech plug. I shot the buck at approximately 40 yards and the
deer only went about 30 yards after a clean through lung shot.
Best regards, Don Greene
I included a couple of
pictures of my deer from '04, in case you needed a picture for your site. I was
shooting a .45 Encore with the .25 ACP Breechplug, 105 grains 777 FFFg and a 200
grain D.C. The deer grossed 162 3/8.
Thanks again, and take care, Matt Epp
Every now and then something new comes along
that just has to be shared with fellow shooters.
Above: TC Encore modified breach plug to use .660" long .22 Hornet cases in
place of the 209 primer.
The folks at Precision Rifle have this to say
about their reasons for developing an improvement to the Encore / Omega.
"Too much flame; too much fouling: Our
Thompson Center Encore gets so dirty from the 209 primer that after 50 shots
the firing pin will not even travel far enough to ignite the primer. I need to
remove the butt stock and clean the entire action with brake clean and
compressed air before it will work. Too much flame trying to get through the
small hole.
If you check out the cartridge in the foreground of the photo you can see
that it is perfectly clean. It has been used 27 times and has not even been
wiped off. No fouling, no mess. Look inside the breach plug and action; 50
shots without being touched and not a spot of fouling anywhere.
Too much energy: I have no idea who
started the 209 craze but I believe that it provides way more energy than is
required to get the job done. Try this experiment for yourself. Take your
ramrod with a jag and a clean damp patch, push it all the way down the barrel
of your TC Encore. Mark the ramrod where it meets the end of the barrel with a
strip of masking tape. Put a 209 into the breach plug, close the gun, cock the
hammer and pull the trigger. With our Thompson Center Encore, the ramrod will
get blown 6"- 8" up the barrel with just the force of the 209. If we do the
same experiment with our Hornet / T/C Encore breach plug with it's small rifle
primer, the ramrod moves less than 1".
We have all but eliminated those unexplained flyers from our TC Encore
groups. Personally, I believe these flyers were the result of the 209
actually lifting the sabot off the powder charge simultaneous with igniting
the powder. The much milder Small Rifle primer of the Hornet case ignites the
powder just as instantly but lacks the energy to move the sabot and bullet off
the powder charge therefore eliminating the flyers.
More fine tuning options: Unlike the
209, Small Rifle sized primers come in a variety of ranges and qualities. One
can experiment with Standard, Magnum and Bench Rest to add one more variable
to the mix. To this point, we have seen the best success with CCI 400 but that
could change with the next load.
To sum up, I love this conversion. The Thompson Center Encore is now
perfectly clean inside and out shot after shot. I have eliminated the flyers
caused by the excessive 209 energy levels. I find the shortened .22 Hornet
cases very easy to install, remove and find in my pockets. One case has been
primed over 40 times with the primer pocket fit as snug as it way when we
first used it. We decap and prime the cases with the very economical Lee
line of reloading equipment. As you loose them, you simply trim down
another handful of .22 Hornet brass and away you go.
The .22 Hornet, possibly one of the most enduring cartridges ever designed,
lends itself for yet another purpose.
June 20th update:
It's not often that we are granted the luxury of head to head comparisons
of one idea versus another idea. Today was one of those rare days.
We headed to the range with a pair of brand new T/C Omega rifles.
One in .45 and the other in .50. The .45 was posting groups of 3.5" to
4.0" throughout the entire day with no real pattern being evident. It's owner
guessed it might be the bedding or the new scope but was really quite
disappointed.
The .50, on the other hand, had a pretty good day. Most everything shot
about 1.5" to 2" and it did not seem very fussy. The crowing moment came when
I decided to try our 195 gr Dead Center Duplex sabots. Three shots touched at
100 yards and life was wonderful.
The .50 had been fitted with the
.22 Hornet breach plug while the .45 was using the factory 209 style. During a
short rain delay, I suggested that we take the best combination that we had
come across with the .45 and try it again but this time use the .22 Hornet
breach plug instead of the 209. It was agreed and the gun was loaded with 100
grains of Triple 7 FFF powder and 195 grain Dead Center bullet. The only
change was instead of the 209, we used the shortened .22 Hornet case with a
CCI 400 primer. Magic; the group shrunk by 75% to right around 1" at 100
yards. With a little encouragement, the shooter completed a second three shot
group which measured just under 1.3" . The best two groups back to back that
this Omega had ever shot and the only change was CCI 400 small rifle primer in
place of the 209 shotgun primer. The day ended and we not only had a
"semi-believer" converted; we also had another breach plug to convert."
Want your breach plug converted for your T/C Encore,
Omega, G2 (.45 cal only) or NEF?
It seems that Precision Rifle is not the only shooter interested in improving
the the accuracy of their muzzleloaders that use the 209 primer. Their e-mail
and telephone lines have lit up since they first posted this page on their
website.
Precision rifle has come up with an even better
solution than the .22 hornet conversion.
After much research and testing, they have come up with
.25 ACP T/C Omega & Encore breech plugs conversions.
What makes this a better idea is this conversion offers
the same accuracy as the .22 hornet conversion, but there is no trimming or
fitting involved and they offer the versatility of using either small rifle or
pistol primers.
R & P Muzzleloading now
offers these (.25 ACP Breech Plug conversion) "Precision Rifle
Accu-Fire Breech Plugs" for the T/C Encore, T/C Omega.
They are only $59.95. Each
conversion kit includes a dozen .25 ACP cases and will be shipped by 2-3 day
Priority Mail. Order today and have it shipped today.
Someone suggested that I put together a priming kit for the .25
ACP brass. Excellent idea, I wish there would have been one of these available
when I bought my breech plug conversion. The kit contains 1 Lee Auto-Prime tool
with two shelves; 1 .25 ACP case holder; 1 1/16" pin punch. Everything you need
to prime your .25 ACP casings.
Now available, a .25 ACP brass
priming kit. This kit contains all the tools needed to prime
and re-prime your .25 ACP brass. Click here for
details...
Introducing The Locker-Pin for the T/C
Encore
..the only permanent solution to the T/C Encore pin movement
problem
The problem: Pin movement side
to side and rotation Most everyone who shoots the Encore has experienced pin
movement at some time or another. If the pin moves side to side or rotates, the
point of impact will shift and accuracy will be effected. Cecil's most extreme
example was when his pin had slid all the way to the side of the fore-end
causing his .22-250 barrel to shoot 12" right.
The solution: The Locker-Pin
Machined from hardened 4140 Chrome Moly The Locker-Pin is the ultimate solution.
Simply slide the pin in place and screw the locker side with the supplied Allen
wrench. No rotation; no left and right; no change of impact. Hundreds of shots
and so far, zero movement.
Fitting of the fore-end: To
achieve the best accuracy from your Encore, the fore-end must not rub on the
side of the frame. In other words, the ears of the fore-end that are designed to
keep the factory T/C pin in place must be filed, ground or sanded so they are
not contacting the Metal (side of the frame). Personally, I grind the inside of
the fore-end ears until they clear the The Locker-Pin by the thickness of a
match book cover or a business card. This allows plenty of free space so the
fore-end does not put pressure on the barrel by contacting the side of the
frame. Questions, call toll free 1 877-662-7468.
Most bullets designed to
shoot well in a 1 in 28 inch twist barrel will normally do so somewhere
between 100 and 120 grains (always measure by volume) of loose Triple 7 powder.
Fact; Triple 7 loose powder is hotter than Pyrodex or regular Triple 7 pellets
(this does not include the new Triple 7 Magnum pellets) by about 15%. That
means, shooting 2 of either of these pellets is equivalent to approximately 85
grains of loose Triple 7. Shooting 3 pellets is equivalent to about 130 grains
of loose powder. This means by using 2 or 3 of the 50-grain pellets you will
miss the window for best velocity and accuracy possible, IF your chosen bullet
was designed to shoot well in a 1 in 28 twist rifle.
What determines how well a Muzzleloading
bullet shoots? By this, I mean, "What enables it to achieve its best
velocity and accuracy?" I believe it achieves this if it reaches the optimum
rate of spin needed to stabilize it in flight (how fast you push the bullet
through the barrel and the barrels rate of twist will determine how much spin is
put on the bullet). How does one know when this happens? Well, I suggest one way
to determine this is to start by over spinning the muzzleloader bullet (shooting
it with too much powder) and measuring your 3 to 5 shot groups. Be
sure to follow a good in between shot routine or none of this will make any
difference; click here to read the steps. Back off on the powder 5
increments in volume shoot another 3 to 5 shot group. Your groups will tell you
when your muzzleloader bullet has reached its optimum rate of spin. Normally the
higher the ballistic coefficient of your bullet the more spin it will need to
stabilize it. I submit that if your Muzzleloading bullet is designed to shoot
its best in a 1 in 28 twist barrel, this will occur somewhere between 100 and
120 grains of loose Triple 7 powder.
If I am correct, and I believe I am, using 2 or 3 of the 50
grain pellets misses the window for your best accuracy completely.
Now some are going to suggest using 2 50-grain and 1 30-grain
pellet to fall within the window above. That might work, but unlike loose
powder, it does not allow for a 5 grain more or less powder test for best flight
and accuracy.
Here is what Hodgdon's says about loose powder on their website.
Triple Seven produces the highest velocities of all granular muzzleloading
propellants when compared by volume (see Comparison Chart below). An added
bonus is that this enhanced velocity results in a flatter trajectory and
greater down range energy.
Triple Seven works with all styles and brands of projectiles which makes
it easy to find a load and maintain accuracy.
Enhanced velocity results in a flatter trajectory and greater
down range energy... Wait, couldn't you achieve that with 3 50-grain pellets?
Velocity yes, but if you can't hit what you are shooting at...
Easy to find a load and maintain accuracy... Well, now isn't
that what we are all striving for. Why don't they say that about their pellets?
Because they know you can't do it with pellets. Instead, ease of use is their
selling pitch.
I submit that it would be nice if you could have both, but most
of the time it just doesn't work out that way. My assumption is that you are
considering a .25 ACP Breech Plug conversion for two reasons; cleanliness and
the best velocity and accuracy possible. Why would you
only go half of the way with a cleaner ignition system designed to allow your
gun to achieve its best possible accuracy and velocity, by using pellets? Take
the leap to loose powder. You won't be sorry you did.
It seems the T/C Encore 209 x 50 has had some mixed results from
various users. Some are getting sub 1 inch groups at 200 yards, while others
can't hit in a 2 foot square at 50 yards. I got some testing information from my
manufacturer on an Thompson Center Encore he tested. I will try and summarize
his experience with the TC Encore. There are a few things one can do that might
go a long way toward improving the accuracy of this rifle. One thing to check,
is the trigger pull. If it is over 3 pounds then it could use some work. Check
the butt stock for looseness and tighten it with an Allen wrench if necessary.
Ensure the fore end is not rubbing on the receiver. A little sand paper will
correct this. Check to see if the pin that is used to attach the barrel is good
and tight. If not, you may need to machine a tighter one for it. After this your
T/C Encore should shoot very well indeed. The below groups were shot using the
Dead Center .40 200 grain bullets.
Below are a few emails my manufacturer has
received from folks using his PR Bullets and their T/C Encore.
Just wanted to let you know, this last weekend I
shot your Precision Dead Center 240 grain bullet and sabot in my T/C Encore
209x50 Muzzleloader. I started with 100 grains and ended with 120 grains of
Hodgden 777 powder. At 75 yards and up to 100 yards I was shooting 0.75 inch
groups with this combination. I also had installed a spring kit from BellM to
lighten the pull to approx. 2 lbs. Other than this the TC Encore is stock. Last
season when I bought the gun I was shooting approx. 4-5 inch groups with the
stock trigger pull and both weights of CVA Powerbelts. Since these groups were
not really what I expected from this gun, I decided to change things for more
accuracy. After reading your article on changes you made to a test 209X50 TC
Encore, I became motivated to do the same thing. Hence the results I got! I am
highly impressed with the quality and accuracy of your Dead Center bullets!!!
What a great product you make. I only hope other hunters see the light and use
your bullets for all their hunting needs!
Again, Thanks Jack G.
Ingle
PRbullet!
I have enjoyed shooting your bullets, I have
purchased 300 of your Dead Center .40 cal 200 grain for my T/C Encore, very
nice. I have also shot approx 200 of your QT .40 cal 250 .44 cal. Wonderful
expansion on recovered bullets. I am currently working with your .40 250 grain
QT, but due to Indiana law I must use a .44 cal bullet. I have now shot 150
rounds through my T/C Encore . . . after using your loading and "spit patching"
procedure. To say the least I am pleased. I tell everyone about your product!
Thanks for all the good work. Looking forward to your ballistics on the Dead
Center 260 grain.
Thanks again! Todd Wiedell
2003 T/C - Hornet
Conversion Matt Epp 172 3/8"
B&C gross - 200 Dead Center - .45 TC Encore
Dear Sirs,
I would like to take this time to thank you for
a fantastic product. On November 12, 2002 I made the most efficient humane kill
ever with a muzzleloader. The result was a nine point buck with a 20 inch inside
spread. The buck weighed 163 lbs. I dropped him with your dead center 45 caliber
240 gr. right in his tracks. I am shooting a nickel size group at 100 yards with
a Thompson Center Encore and a 100 gr. of triple seven and your dead
center sabots. This is a great combination that I plan to use over and over
again. Again Thank you for our product and I look forward to seeing what you
have to offer in the future.
Sincerely, Michael K. Williams
Hi Ray,
This deer I recently took during muzzleloader season using a
CVA 50. cal inline using your .25 ACP breech plug
system. The bullet was a 245gr.Barnes spitfire. Powder charge was 3 - 50gr
Pyrodex pellets. The shot was 192 yards with the bullet traveling through both
lungs and between the ribs. (No Bone contact) After firing the shot which was
over the backs of two does to hit the buck, which was a 8" inch window over the
does. The buck ran 175 yards before falling over dead in a thicket. I was only
able to find 3 drops of blood of about the size of the end of a "Q" tip.
Needless to say, tracking was somewhat awful being no snow on the ground. His
hoof track is basically all I had to go by. After 15 minutes of tracking I found
the deer piled up in the nearby thicket where I saw him run too. He bled out
entirely inside his chest cavity. The exit wound was exactly the size of the
entrance wound (no expansion at all). Basically like shooting a full metal jacket. Nice
sweet long range with the Barnes spitfire but poor expansion of the bullet.
Still an awesome shot for any gun. But I do love the ease of a good blood
trail.
As for the .25 ACP system, It rocks!!
At 200 yards and 150gr Pyrodex pellets and bench rested I am placing minus
3"inch groups 6"inches low. At 125 yards I am 2"inches high cutting bullet for
bullet and swabbing with a spit patch on all shots. Never to
return to the 209 system. Next year I will try another style of bullet.
The Barnes tipped MZ with its large hollow point looks like possibility or
Hornady's new SST.
